What does the loss to Everton mean in terms of the race for top-four?
GunnerPunner: Obviously the title’s gone, and it looks like a straight shoot-out between us and Everton for 4th. They’re ahead if they win their game in hand, and it’s no longer in our own hands, but they have City and Liverpool to play. I can’t believe we’re even talking about this given where we were. I’d say that if we win all our remaining games we’ll make top 4 comfortable but I just don’t know what to expect from this team anymore.
FormidableTH14: The game itself was a nightmare, but when context is taken into consideration this is really not as big a disaster as most people are making out. Everton’s fixture list involves both Manchester clubs and an in-form Southampton whilst ours only features 1 team in the top 10. I’m still more than confident of top 4.
Tomthegunner: I’d still have us as favourites, but it means that we’re looking over our shoulders a lot more. People seem to ignore the fact that Everton still have to play Manchester United, Manchester City and Southampton – all very tricky games, whilst we have (touch-wood) easier fixtures. I think we will make it, but it really is beyond a joke that we have gone from competing for the title to battling hard for fourth in a month.
Questions will be asked of Arsène Wenger. Where do you stand on the man: Should he go at the end of the season?
GunnerPunner: I try to avoid standing on him as I think it’s an invasion of his personal space. As a manager, he’s done an awful lot for the club and put the club ahead of his own reputation for the last 9 or 10 years when he’s had chances to go to Real Madrid & PSG to name just two. I really think this year is the first one we can truly see us emerging from the period of transition that has set us up to be able to compete financially with almost anyone out there, and I think we have to recognise that Arsene Wenger has seen us through that period. Regardless of what we have or haven’t won, at the start of every season we’ve been in the biggest competition around and that shouldn’t be ignored. Yes – he is stubborn, but I laugh when people question his desire to win. No matter how upset you think you are when we lose, be sure it hurts him more. I think he deserves this summer to make big changes now he’s actually able to reap the rewards of the hard work he’s put in over the last 10 years. I think it’d be an injustice to let someone else come in and get all the benefits with none of the sacrifice.
*However* I also think that’s dependent on us making the top four, and probably winning the FA Cup. Top four and a trophy is a good season. Maybe not the season everyone thought we could’ve had in January, but February and March were always going to be tough. Perspective is important. People can forget about calling for him to be sacked because having watched Arsène Wenger for the past 18 years I get the impression he’ll walk if he doesn’t think he has anything left to offer the club. In short, let’s just hope we finish this season on a high.
FormidableTH14: Starting to want change more and more but I maintain that it would just be disgraceful to “sack” the man so leaving at his own accord, preferably with an FA cup to hand, would be the best way to go about it.
Tomthegunner: I’ve never been a Wenger out man, I respect Arsene hugely and appreciate how much he has done for the club over his 16 year reign, but I think that his contract expiring and him leaving at the end of the season wouldn’t be the worst scenario. Arsene is a brilliant manager, and I think that we have been incredibly lucky to have him, as I can’t imagine anyone else sacrificing valuable years of their managerial career to ensure that a club is financially stable, but I think that this season more than any has exposed his tactical weaknesses, especially against the big clubs.
When Wenger does leave – be that at the end of the season or in a few years – what kind of manager would you like to see come in? Do any names stand out?
GunnerPunner: You want somebody who’s going to win trophies and do so playing good football. That’s at the heart of everything this club stands for. Many want a younger name. If you go for younger managers, you’re looking at maybe three who’d be up to it. Martinez won’t come unless we throw a fortune at Everton to effectively *buy* him and Rodgers obviously won’t come any time soon. Klopp is popular with many but his teams have a history of being rolled over too easily at times, and I wonder if his tactics would work in the Premiership against fitter, less-attacking sides who won’t come forward and won’t tire so easily. I get the impression the club want Wenger for another two years until Guardiola’s deal at Bayern expires, but then you’re competing with other teams and that’s only if he decides to leave. For me, the stand-out candidate would be Ancelotti. I’m a big fan and he’s previously admitted he’d be interested in managing Arsenal. He won everything (I think) at Milan, won the double with Chelsea, the league with PSG and has had a big impact on a number of younger players at Madrid. I don’t think there’s a better option out there.
FormidableTH14: Simeone has an air of brilliance about him but I’m struggling to find reasons why he’d want to join us with the great work he’s doing down in Madrid. Klopp has always been a distinct possibility but BVB’s slight collapse this season has put me off. Which leaves Roberto Martinez – in my opinion the perfect man to carry forth Arsene’s legacy; tactically masterful, good with the media, excellent player handling, and always looking at long-term benefits at whatever club he is in.
Tomthegunner: Liverpool from 2010-2012 are an example of exactly what NOT to do. We need a manager with a philosophy, and a manager with stability. We’re more than an attractive offer for most managers out there, and the faith that the board has shown in Wenger in the past few years will only enhance that. We need somebody tactically astute, and somebody who is willing to address and prevent the recurring injures that we face each year. Two obvious candidates arise in Roberto Martinez and Jurgen Klopp, and whilst I’d be happy with either of them, I’d prefer somebody else – Diego Simeone. He’s managed to make La Liga less of a two horse race, and his tactical ability can’t be denied, and as such I’d love to see him at Arsenal in the future.
Arsenal have lost yet another big game. How much comes down to the manager or is it more to do with the players?
GunnerPunner: Both. Everyone. All of them. If it was one thing, it’d be easy to fix. I really don’t know but I don’t think today taught us anything we didn’t already know. We have a system that works with a full squad, and even with a couple of injuries, but we lost a host of key attacking players. We’re now left with a midfield who can’t keep the ball, nobody who can run a game and very little pace. I think all our problems recently stem from our lack of attacking options. We’re getting caught out because our defensive midfielders are joining attacks due to the lack of ideas. I also think something’s gone mentally that could prove very hard to get back. Having said that, Ramsey’s return was encouraging – not least because he’s been our best player this season – but also because he won’t have the same scars the others have from those big defeats.
FormidableTH14: Both tactical ineptitude and “lack of desire” which is clichéd but still relevant. Arsene made some absolutely hideous decisions – something I find myself saying all too often – but there is no excusing the attitude of some of the players out there. You’re playing for Arsenal, for God’s sake!
Tomthegunner: Manager. Losing 3-0 against a rival can be put down to a combination of the two. A 1-0 loss can be put down to the players. But conceding 50% of all goals conceded against top 5 opposition shows that structurally the team is weak, or the players don’t understand their roles – both of which ultimately fall down to manager.
Olivier Giroud and Mikel Arteta have both come in for a lot of criticism. Do you think fans are being harsh on said players or do they deserve the stick they get?
GunnerPunner: I think our fans are too harsh on most of our players and far too fickle. Giroud is a very good striker. He’s not a 20-goals-a-season striker, but he’s far from bad. He thrived earlier in the season with pace around him, runners in behind and support around his feet. Those players have been injured and the others aren’t able to do the same job. He’s been far too isolated for months now. I feel that he gets so much stick for not being a quick, run-in-behind goalscorer. That didn’t matter when we had the right players with him. It’s not *his* fault that he isn’t a different type of striker. We need options. We need other options so when we don’t have support for Giroud we can play another striker. It seems Giroud is just the default target for a lot of the anger towards us not signing another striker.
Arteta got stick before he started playing badly. He was very good at the start of the season and did well when he had the more mobile Wilshere & Ramsey alongside him. He struggles when pressed and his legs have certainly gone, but he’s been left even more exposed and his flaws are even more visible now that the players who acted as foils aren’t there. The Flamini/Arteta debate amuses me because, in reality, we can do much better than both of them.
FormidableTH14: Ever since Giroud’s pathetic little affair I have never been able to appreciate anything about him, and he is not helping my view of him in the slightest. Arteta is a different story – an excellent vice-captain, a true role model, and a thorough professional who doesn’t warrant an ounce of the awful abuse he gets. He’s been very very poor but no worse than his partner in crime, Flamini, and some people take for granted Mikel’s majestic displays against the likes of Liverpool back in 2013 which saw us top the league for so long.
Tomthegunner: Both yes and no. Yes, in the manner that some of the performances that these two have put in (Giroud more so) have been abysmal, they’ve looked a shadow of the players that we know they can be, so the criticism is to be expected. However, it’s not the players fault that they are the only players in their position, and that sufficient depth isn’t there, so it’s important to keep that in mind when criticising a performance. Arteta is 32 now, surely Wenger didn’t believe that he could do another 38 game season, competing for the title, without a drop in quality.
Where do we go from here?
GunnerPunner: WEMBLEY
FormidableTH14: Don’t f*** up the FA cup, scrape fourth somehow, Arsene stays or leaves, some stellar business pre-world cup, top class strikers (emphasis on the plural), new MF partner for Ramsey, and we’re ready to contest again (properly, this time) next season. Not all doom and gloom, eh?
Tomthegunner: We beat Wigan in the FA Cup Semi-Finals. We win the remainder of our games and grab fourth. Then win the FA Cup. Obviously it will not be simple, but if this scenario does ensue, I think Wenger could leave with his head held high, whilst still allowing the club to move on.
